I bump it for 1 reason tho.
Is the topic locked?
No? Then it shouldn’t be considered dead.
I disagree with that one.
- I don’t think Vulcan needs a buff on high power (19700 dps would be way too much).
- Yeah, the progression isn’t completely linear, but it’s fine.
5 Likes
So it’s now been a couple months.
How are we feeling about Absolver, everyone? (And what does the usage data look like now, btw? For all weapons)
3 Likes
I’d like to suggest a damage nerf for plasma, and a longer overheat time.
3920 damage is just overdoing it.
2 Likes
Haven’t tested these numbers, I’m just eyeballing it.
- Damage scaling: 1,25 (some ugly numbers on
1 and 3 , bit higher damage than the old values (16250 vs 15600). - AoE multiplier: 0,2 (a bit over half as much damage as the old pre-buff AoE, what do you reckon?)
- Overheat time: probably 7 seconds, could maybe be pushed to 7,5 due to the low rate of fire (and therefore faster effective overheat)
Overall, the premise of the buff was so that Plasma wouldn’t be rubbish against bosses. The problem, of course, is that giving it more raw damage screws with its balance in regular waves. The old 15600 DPS was acceptable pre-overdrive, because you could just use manual and have a 13 second overheat time to compensate for the sub-par damage output. I thought that giving it 19.5k would work, but it’s just straight up busted.
I guess you could[citation needed] bring the scaling back to 1,2 (same 15600 dps), AoE multiplier of 0,3 or thereabouts and make it so that bosses take damage from both the beam and the AoE. Or you could add the damage ramp back, but make it so that it either only works on bosses or always resets on target change.
6 Likes
I noticed that any auto-lock weapons (especially Plasma and Positron) are comparatively superior than non auto-lock weapons in non-boss waves. This is more noticable in ironman challenge. I suspect this is because they gurantee hit while most enemies become very deadly to come nearby.
TL;DR: they’re strong by design.
Even I, a frequent user of vulcan chaingun, I consider it excessive
I can see the changes there.
Can we buff the firerate of moron-railgun?
As if it isn’t fast enough already
I watch Davoid 's video and I see the old moron-railgun’s firerate is faster than the new one.
It was too strong before and couldn’t even overheat at low firepower level.
Wow, Positron as shot wayy up. Plasma still remains pretty low, but I wonder how the graph would look when taking into account successful attempts at higher difficulty levels. Also, Absolver isn’t the least used weapon anymore? That’s surprising. I think it has to do with newer players, more casual players using it because it’s more fun to use.
1 Like
Woah, didnt think Laser Cannon is the least popular weapon, even lower than Corn.
Lower than moron railgun.
I’ve decided to break up this batch of reworks into two posts, since several weapons (Laser, Plasma, Positron, Absolver) will require more severe changes and I need a bit more time to cover them. Most changes in this post are simple value tweaks, with a couple of more involved modifications.
Neutron Gun
- Damage: 330/660/990 → 300/600/900
- Interval: 0.263 (3.80/s) → 0.240 (4.17/s)
Overall firerate increase.
Vulcan Chaingun
- Damage: 160/300/420 → 125/250/375
- Base overheat: 7.8s → 8s
Overall damage nerf (same as previously, but with a stronger Strong projectile), slight overheat buff (though mainly to round it up to .5).
In addition to the above changes, we propose reducing Vulcan’s maximum spread to around the same level it has currently when the player has two spread condensers equipped. Such a change would improve its overall usability and stop it from being a requirement for Comet Chase missions (bring its performance in line with other weapons).
Lightning Fryer
- Damage:
140 215 290 395 510 645 780 940 1100 1290 1500 1800
→
160 280 400 530 660 790 920 1050 1180 1320 1500 1800 - Base overheat: 8s → 8.5s
Overall revamp of the progression: mostly linear, stronger on low power
Plasma Rifle
- AoE multiplier: 0.185 → 0.150
It’s possible that Plasma might need an extensive rework in the future. Lowering the AoE’s damage should make it a bit more balanced for now. The issue of its potential rework will be discussed in the next post.
Utensil Poker
- Damage: 310/620 → 300/600
Reduction in damage on 
0-10.
Along with Laser and Riddler, Utensil requires an additional firerate increase on max power to satisfy the requirement of a max power DPS increase in the 20%-25% range. While in Riddler’s case this isn’t particularly noticeable, I’d like to eliminate this issue in the other two weapons. For this reason I made a new max power volley for Utensil, which makes the DPS increase exactly 25%.
Current volley:
New volley: 
This is essentially a modified 10 volley: the central carving fork is replaced with a regular fork, and two additional carving forks are fired from the front weapon pods. The latter two carving forks are fired at half the offset of the ones fired from the rear pods – identical to the two forks on 1.
We’d also like to propose applying a general reduction to Utensil’s spread (similar to Vulcan’s mentioned above), to around the level it’s at currently with two spread condensers equipped. The reason for this change is that after Ion’s volley rework during the first stage of WBP, it became more focused in relation to Utensil, making it much easier for it to dispense concentrated firepower compared to its direct spreadgun competitor.
Boron Railgun
- Damage: 110/180/240 → 120/180/240
Slight buff to weak projectile.
Photon Swarm
Firerate: 4/0.933 (4/s - 13.33/s) (interval: 0.25 - 0.075) → 4.25/0.936 (4.25/s - 13.61/s) (interval: 0.235 - 0.073)
DPS/firerate increase.
It’s possible that Photon’s high firerate will clash with technical limitations of multiplayer (as mentioned here by iA), but it should be fine for now.
Riddler
Interval: 0-10: 0.100 (10/s) → 0.097 (10.31/s); 20: 0.095 (10.53/s) → 0.092 (10.87/s)
Slight DPS/firerate increase
We’d like to once again suggest removing Riddler’s additional spread on low power as it makes the weapon practically unusable for the first few power levels. It reduces its performance artificially, and makes it a terrible starting weapon should a new player buy it as their first.
Corn Shotgun
Interval: 0.625 - 0.222 (1.6/s - 4.5/s) → Firerate: 1.75/0.25 (1.75/s - 4.25/s) (Interval: 0.571 - 0.235)
General rebalance, major firerate increase on low power, re-added the firerate formula to the Excel sheet.
Those are its final values for the foreseeable future. If implemented now, it’ll be a bit underpowered on high power until overdrive is reworked (and therefore can be applied to this weapon), but I think it should be implemented anyway due to the buff to starter firerate (which I’d argue is more important).
Moron Railgun
Damage: 110/220 → 110/165
Interval: 0.145 - 0.145 → 0.145 - 0.095
Overdrive: 33%
Made progression (both projectile damage multipliers and firerate) consistent with Boron, should be more usable overall due to the firerate increase (as mentioned here).
There are now essentially three levels to its progression:
-
1-2 - +110 DPV and firerate increase,
-
3-6 - +55 DPV and firerate increase,
-
7-10 - +0 DPV and firerate increase.
The addition of overdrive was discussed in the same thread, and may be a permanent or temporary measure depending on whether or not Moron will be replaced/removed or not.
Other changes
Most weapons had their low power overheat values modified. The boost was removed from weapons that have a constant hit rate across all power levels (Plasma, Positron), introduced to Riddler, Corn, and Moron, and made less severe on other weapons.
Excel sheet (missing changes to Laser, Positron, and Absolver): https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/702487693636010054/866390831140569088/CIU-WeaponData-v85.override.xls
Edit: updated spreadsheet with missing Riddler buff.
8 Likes
iA, is this some sort of debug/dev mode inside the game?
Small update/revision while we’re still working on the remaining weapons (also in a new post, because you bet I’m going to take the opportunity to bump this to the top).
Boron Railgun
Damage: 120/180/240 → 135/200/265
Heat multiplier: 1.85 → 1.8 (max damage 222/333/444 → 243/360/477)
Overall damage buff. Heat multiplier slightly lowered to allow for a more significant buff to base damage while avoiding complete overkill.
Moron Railgun
Damage: 110/165 → 115/170
Slight damage buff. Deals roughly 85% of Boron’s base damage for corresponding projectiles.
Excel sheet: https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/702487693636010054/872189349561782322/CIU-WeaponData-v85.override.xls
6 Likes