An update also changes the whole expierience. We aren’t iterating on the same constantly like Terraria or Hollow Knight. That’s like they made Terraria 2 and then tried to make Terraria 1 as good as Terraria 2. Kinda pointless since you have Terraria 2? They’re not supposed to be the same.
And again, what if someone wanted to play the same way they did back in the day the old games? They’re there for that, and we got a iterative game CIU like terraria, where it will constantly be better. If we changed the old, we would lose them. I can only agree on the point to have an additional update to the games to implement the new SSH mechanics. But they shouldn’t replace the old ones.
What if you wanted to play the original mario bros. for nostalgia, speedruning or for plain old old school fun? You can’t, because they changed it to the newer version. Why? We got a new game just for that.
So? This game also is less casual than the previous ones, should we alter the old expierience? We got CIU just for the new bosses, and if you want to play with old bosses you have the episodes. What’s the point? Because they look bad in comparison? Again, I don’t think so, and probably a matter of opinion.
I’m up for items, skills, ship etc. just not something exlusive to challanges that would give you an advantage over other players period. Like a ship that dealt 10% more damage and had the stats of the best one. I wouldn’t want that.
I was thinking more motion blur and less actual useful blur. I agree, this is a engine limitation that is a limitation. Like all limitations. Limitation. That’s a word.
You know there can be one time medals that could basically act like achievements, right? Like the explore entire galaxy one? Ohhhh Waaaait. Right. No I gotcha. Alright sorry, achievements could be nice.
I still think they should be kept for preservation purposes. Again, at most, an additional gamemode with new difficulty. At most.
Obviously,the developers will create a new game in hopes that it will be worse than older ones.
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Ciu might make the older ci games look worse(duh,why would they create a new game? So that it would be worse than older games,and so that no one would play it?),but does it really make them look bad? I’d disagree. I’d say why,but I think that Davoid already covered that.
I wouldn’t call “more HP SSH” good experience. Sure someone can have good memory with it, but update would just make the bosses fight better so no one should have a problem with that.
We are “iterating” on the same bosses. And yeah, no constantly, but after release of CIU it’s less likely that bosses here will have another rework so just one update of bosses in older games will make them the same.
Dumb explanation. Terraria 2 would be a sequel or prequel so it would have new bosses. It would be like making spin-off Terraria game that consists of boss fights from Terraria 1 and Terraria 2 and making some changes in bosses which are good, community loves them, but the old games don’t have the bosses updated
So you want to have two SSH difficulties?
Once again. Mario games don’t feature bosses that appeared in older games (we’re not counting mario maker 1&2 because they are strictly made about using the older games).
Guess why it’s less casual. Because it has better bosses which on higher difficulties have better attacks and more speed. Yes we should alter the old experience if it sucks. And SSH in older games sucks. It was always just more HP (and more points for new lives) here it is finally solved so why can’t we use that?
Exactly the point. Imagine this ridiculous situation which I believe is ultimately what IA wants the CIU to do: new player who had totally no clue about any of the chicken invaders games plays the Chicken Invaders Universe and falls in love with it. Because of that he/she proceeds to buy one of older games. Unblocks the SSH difficulty because it’s the difficulty at which he/she played and had the most fun and plays the game only to be disappointed that in older games bosses are just bullet sponge joke. BAM, you have one fan less and also a disappointed customer who may have want the refund and never returns to the franchise.
Can you make up your mind?
Harder difficulty level isn’t exactly giving you advantage over other players. It can make you earn more keys, but it comes with a harder gameplay price.
In CIU I agree, but in new episode of Chicken Invaders it could work.
Eww, who would want motion blur.
It still don’t find it this way. Medal for exploring the galaxy should exactly be the achievement. Other medals are shown at the end of every mission so you can know how good you played it and they act like a statistics.
We can just update SSH difficulty and keep the lower difficulties the same.
Maybe not in hopes, but as already Traveller stated it happens often.
Yes, yes it does.
Normally game developers make a new game to make a better game, but they also don’t use the existing enemies. If some of them are returning then it’s either prequel or sequel so it makes sense that they are kind of different because they are evolving. CIU just uses the same bosses from the same point in time and makes them better. I see no reasons why we can’t have the better bosses in older games if we know how to make them better.
Yes,ciu might not be a sequel,but it’s not a totally new game,either. It’s a spin-off,so I don’t see a problem with it re-using some of the stuff from previous games.
Yeah, no. You obviously didn’t read my first post here. I like older games very much, but that doesn’t mean I don’t want them to be better if it’s possible.
Yeah, Mr. T kinda doesn’t fit in this topic, but the other two fit perfectly. And the discussion here isn’t only made with sentences. If you agree with someone there’s no need to write it. You just “like” the post to show that you agree with statement that someone made. And wouldn’t you know who liked Davoid posts.
Great that we agree on that.
Yes it does make them look bad, because older games bosses can be described as bullet sponge which is one of the worst designs in gaming. Now that wasn’t such a problem to me because that’s how it was in Chicken Invaders since CI2. However here in CIU, InterAction Studios proved that they can make difficulty something more than bullet-sponge. And this makes the bullet sponge completely questionable in older games.
No one. Let me make it more clear. NO ONE has a problem that it uses stuff from the previous games (not counting music, but that’s my personal opinion). The game is built around having stuff from older games so you can play it endlessly (and with more fun than CI1). However the problem I have with it is that it took bosses from previous parts and made them better which honestly is a good thing, but as I said many times it damages older games.
Bowser
He is used in every single game.
Obviously in some ways he is different mechanically, but in some he’s just an upgrade. In old mario he only jumped and shot fire. In something like new super mario bros he does all that, but also shoot a lot of fire at once for them to land back on the platform. Why not make the old games harder then?
(Also the koopalings)
Noo one. No one. Nobody. How do you know? What if someone, that one person liked that? I guess he doesn’t count.
But here’s a question. Why update an old game, take all the effort to make that boss like in the new game he’s already in, just to appease a tiny minority of players who play that game? And change it from it’s original state? We aren’t talking about a new game ready for patches, we are talking about the old legacy game. Why? Because the new game is better? Maybe we should just stop making games better and have one game that has everything? No code could get messy. Definetly.
You can just call it something else, but yes. Do you want to change the original game forever? Even for those looking for that one specific expierience the game provided in it’s original state? That’s like if they added new power-ups to old mario’s. Or make bowser harder. Why? The game is as it is, and just because a new game is better, they don’t need to make the old one like the new one.
I answered before. But why not count mario maker huh? It’s a spinoff? It makes the old games look puny in comparison? Why don’t they add the things from MM to old mario’s? Because it’s not a reeaaaaal gaaame?
Sucks. Subjectively. If you want to have a casual expierience, play the current episodes. If you want hard mode, play CIU. It has all the old content. What’s the point? Just so you can play it one more time? Not worth it. And I’m not saying they can’t make a new episode with all the new features. They absolutely should! But there’s no point in making the old games like the new ones.
A new fan plays new super mario brothers. He finds the bosses fun and intresting (Ignore the fact the game isn’t actually that good), likes the levels and powerups. He goes back to Super mario brothers. He is fiddling with clunky controls, just the fireflower, and all he fights is same old boring bowser. BAM one less fan and a refund.
See how that doesn’t hold up? That’s like playing the newest game in the series and being sad the old ones aren’t that good. What were you expecting? Old games being better?
I meant gameplay altering as in the super ship. Not skills and power-ups, sorry for confusing you.
ikr
No! This is not preservation? So easier difficulties should not get the same treatment? Just of your personal view on the difficulties? HMMMM. I’ll say it again. At most an additional mode. Why delete the old one? Why? You are the one that thinks the old soundtracks belong with the old, so why do you think changing that expierience is fair?
Let’s say that’s true. What’s the difference beetwen making chickens shoot two eggs at once on higher difficulties, and spawning chickens that shoot two eggs at once? Because in one you would have to go back and change the old games? Then if all the bosses were just in a different skin, would you be happy? Then wh change the old???
Effort that takes time away from the game everyone is playing
Not much reward for little players that can already expierience the same in the new game
Consequence of altering an old game away from it’s original, making you unable to play the game how it was, and forced to play the “only good” version dictated by the developers.
Make them better? We got CIU. That’s a better game! You can play this and not play the old ones because the old ones are a thing!
I don’t know if that’s accusatory or just stating it. Like we aren’t targeting you! We disagree with your opinion and we’re saying why. I think this is a debate or something atleast. This isn’t wrong think, just I don’t understand why you hold the opinion, and trying to change it based on my opnion that I disagree with it.
The old mario games had such bad level design especially the later stages. The hammer bros were just stupid and the way they make levels now make the old game look bad. And this makes level design completely questionable in older games.
It doesn’t damage it! I don’t want to repeat myself so just read my upper posts.
I’ll say again, I’m not trying to be mean, though this reply might have come off a bit emotional. I just don’t understand your stance. I’m trying my best for us to have a opinion-off.
And I made that meme for a reason. Because when I disagree with something, I say exactly why, and I state my opinions and counter-arguments on those. That’s why I make these huge quote-reply walls in my replies.
Inb4 just wait until Chicken Invaders 6 to release in another 4/5/6 years so you could get the same experience with the games below CIU very easy solution newspaper zombie approved
Why are still talking about mario. And why you still don’t understand that mario games are not spin-offs. Bosses in CIU are literally taken from older games and put into the spin-off. But due to some time and testing they were made something better. Something that isn’t bullet sponge. Something that can be used in older games because it won’t make it worse. It can’t be worse than bullet sponge.
Because that means that you respect your fanbase and you want them to have fun playing the game. Also let’s remember that Chicken Invaders games are still purchasable so you want them to sell well and be great right?
Change it for better.
It’s still digital piece of code which can be updated when there’s need to.
To be fair I’m not exactly against it (I disagree with stop making games better). IA could make a DLC packs for CIU which consist of levels that were in older games so they can have more profit from this game (also this would work like remake, but with low amount of work so win-win situation). Your fragment of text “one game that has everything” can be the marketing phrase of Chicken Invaders Universe.
Yeah, someone surely remembers the game positively for bullet-sponge. “Oh man I played such a good game when I was younger. It had this interesting game mechanic which didn’t make enemies harder, but it made everything much longer and it was brilliant!”
They also don’t have any way to update it. First mario games were on cartridges and the devices don’t have updates system for games. With Chicken Invaders (provided they still have the source code) they can make an update and also they can make it completely optional FFS.
Yes, that’s exactly why I’m not counting it because just like CIU it’s a spin-off.
But it doesn’t. There’s so little changes that you would have mainly the same experience.
First of all. CIu doesn’t have all the old content. Second of all what if I want to play older parts again, but also I want to have a challenge?
Depends which one he/she played. If one of main line of mario games he should know that they are released in different years and they are all different. But if he/she played Mario Maker the result is unknown because mario maker actually uses the older game styles in nearly the same way.
I only see that some people can’t be convinced.
When I talk about bringing the upgraded bosses to older games I’m expecting that the games can profit from the updates. And not exactly money profits.
Yeah, because look how it works in CIU. The bosses are harder only if you play it on harder difficulties. Not my personal view, but IA Studios way of doing it.
Fine, I already agreed on a new mode. If you can’t stand just making one update.
Yes it is me. Yes, old soundtracks belong with the old. But changing something for better isn’t destroying the good memories. It can reinforce them. Using old music in new games doesn’t reinforce them.
I’m assuming in second quote you meant “spawning 2 chickens that shoot at once”. Anyway it’s a different thing. Is there a problem with chickens in older games? They don’t feel that much of a bullet sponge as the bosses. Or do they?
No, I wouldn’t. It’s just a texture changed and we know that it’s the same boss.
I’m not talking that IA Studios must abandon everything right now in this moment ASAP and code new updates. In fact I said this: “And yeah, no constantly, but after release of CIU it’s less likely that bosses here will have another rework so just one update of bosses in older games will make them the same.”
Little details also count when it comes to gaming. And I would call making something that is meant to be the final challenge… well… more challenging. And once again, there’s not everything in CIU.
You can have two versions. You can have alternate mode. You can have The Next Wave Remas… Oh yeah. Were there people that did protest about this remaster? I only noticed that spaceship controls a little different and there are different songs (not counting Steam version), but maybe that’s just my memory. I must find the old demos and check it.
That’s the biggest heresy I’ve heard in a very long time. “CIU” and “better game” shouldn’t exist together. You can only use it together when speaking “Episodes are better games than CIU”. Please see this for reasons why - I need to talk about Chicken Invaders - #2 by kokokokos
I know, but Nikito was wondering why I used your painting of critique league.
with this I agree. castle levels and random warp pipes is a bad design.
Well, we have different opinion on this. New mario levels don’t exactly make me want to play them and they don’t make the old game look bad
Nice try, but not true. First level in super mario bros is cult classic when it comes to gamedev and designing a game. Sadly no one thinks this way of Chicken Invaders.
It’s clear we can’t convince each other about why our side is the best. So I suggest that we agree on a update with new difficulty level and not changing it.
Define “better”.
Frozenbyte changed Trine for the better with the Enchanted Edition. Yeah, that went well, didn’t it?
Well, at least they left the original version unchanged.
In all honesty, I think old games should just be left alone.
New players are unlikely to be interested in them either way, and if they were, they’d most likely view them, quite correctly, as older games. And so would take into consideration that the later titles are more polished. CI5 was released nearly 5 years ago. It’s been a long time. It’s not like the older games are unplayable and have to be changed. It’s a waste of time and resources that could be directed at improving the current title that people will actually want to play.
Meanwhile players who have played these games in the past, for example on pirated versions, would likely only buy them for nostalgic reasons. Change these games in any significant way, and the “nostalgic reasons” are no more. They may as well play the newer games, since they can no longer get the experience they want, at least not legitimately.
I’ve played CI2 and CI3 years ago, on pirated versions ofc. I can tell you that I sure as hell wouldn’t consider buying either of them after they were changed.
Foreground asteroids > Automatic fire
Menu chicken > New music
You said it too, but it’s clear we’re on completely opposite sides of the argument. I’ll just address some things. And I think I should probably also be less defensive too.
You got a point… yeah.
I would like them to be great, but I think this approach is not that good. Not only do you have to look back on old code (depending on change size) you have to understand all of it and implement the changes in that old system. What I propose is as you said later either CIU paid DLC, which I would personally really like. You have the episode balance and CIU balance. Or even better. A super-duper remaster of all games up to this point, all shiny and polished. Of course with a bigger price tag, but I think a worth one.
Well yeah. Still changing it.
Alright I think I’m talking more general changes and you’re talking purely the difficulty. Yes, the difficulty can be a additional thing. Yeppo. Just not more, so that the expierience stays the same. (More items, waves etc.)
Optional… optional… I kinda forgot about thaaat. Uhh… yeah. You could have the original game, but that’s rip. We can have the original remaster, and the updated remaster. Yeah, that sounds good!
Yeye. The story, cave waves, baloons etc.
Not neccesarily Mario maker. Just a mario game. But a Chicken Invaders player wouldn’t know the difference? I think they should.
Oh right. It do be like that sometimes.
I was making a point that: In game 1 you have chicken A that shoots an egg on all difficulties. In game 2 you have chicken A that shoots 2 eggs on SSH. You would want this also in the earlier game to make the game more exciting right? If so, then let’s say in game 2 instead there’s chicken B that shoots 2 eggs. Would you like to add him back to game 1? My main point was what’s the difference? But I guess it doesn’t matter now.
Though that is true…
I had no choice /: A separate game copy for the original would still be cool in my opinion, but the least we have is the remaster. I think we should still… treat it with respect as an oldie. I don’t think a remaster is bad, but if you tell me how to get the original then coolios. Otherwise, it’s the base. But sure, somewhat changable.
I was making a point that just because the new game is better, that doesn’t call into question the old ones like you did with CIU and the episodes. I am just using mario as an example, and it’s true most of it’s levels are good. I was just trying to make a point.
You convinced me somewhat here, but then @GgWw1175 's post happened. I agree there could be optional upgrades, but nothing major and largely expierience altering.
Something that is more fun to play and requires more skill than time. There. That’s the definition of better difficulty for me.
I assume that you meant there was something wrong with it, but I can’t find what. Actually all I found is that it was a good remake. Guess I need to finally play it.
I’m curious if after release there will be people that would like the CIU more.
Fair point, but “new optional difficulty” which we both with Davoid agreed wouldn’t change the base game and it would keep the nostalgic reasons while also giving some new challenges.
Welp, too late. I have all the main parts on Steam.
Oh yeah. I remember it now. I don’t use automatic fire. And luckily Steam version has the old “Just to funk” soundtrack so it can live. “Foreground asteroids” and “menu chicken” didn’t alter gameplay, but idk who wasn’t happy with them. They should return. #JusticeForMenuChicken
That’s probably what nearly everybody did. I mean, look at the numbers of votes in the poll. Also I made 3 long as planetary egg city posts and for sure there should be more people that have some doubts about my statements.
